Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Tell us what you think!

Poll: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

No, leave it the way it is now.
85
60%
Yes, completely prohibit MQ2 usage.
14
10%
Limit the MQ2 usage to basic plugins and commands (/stick, etc) and possibly offer a THF MQ2 release.
42
30%
Total votes: 141

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Lillu
Posts: 11301
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Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#11 » Tue May 17, 2016 1:04 pm

jsre wrote:Purely for polling purposes I voted to prohibit, but it would be unfortunate if it went that way now. The server's identity has been well established in the emu community.


Don't be small minded jsre, you are better than that. ;) Good to see you BTW!

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Grey
Posts: 1101

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#12 » Tue May 17, 2016 4:45 pm

I got tired of writing plugins and macros, if i still played I would say the 3rd option but it's almost impossible to police.
From what I have read it seems THF has managed better then most to find a way to handle MQ2 while building content.

If I was ever on the server maybe I would have a better perspective. So I guess my question would be how do the staff feel about this topic? If having to deal with MQ2 and building content is burning the staff out then I would tighten up the rules.
Players come and go so I wouldn't worry to much about that aspect of it, esp knowing the EQEMU community across several servers. It is pretty evenly split on MQ2.

If MQ2 use as is just means the staff are able to be more creative and brutally mean then when the HoH bosses were first released, then leave the rules as they are.
Man o man, those days were the best.

PKinternet
Posts: 277

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#13 » Fri May 20, 2016 2:26 am

Are we talking about Server Population? If so I think MQ2 is probably part of the problem and also part necessary. The thing that caused people to leave the server before MQ2 was the HoH grind. I have been on the server for quite a while and played back when server population was over 300 a night. Once the player base started to mature/level and enter T8, everything grinded to a halt. I can't even list all the folks that I played with who left without ever even seeing Chaos. Some pushed though, most did not. Guilds started to merge to keep the high end content available but that was only partly successful. I was first in Da Plunderin Pirates. We made it into HoH, however, we could never beat a boss. That was back in Dec. 2011. My first Spider Queen kill came about Aug. 2012 over 6 months later. My first Chaos kill was with Spitfire somewhere around January 2013. So for me it took just over a year to progress though HoH. For the folks that I came up with on this server that timing was similar. Very few players made it to the end. After that MQ2 was introduced but the damage to the player base was done IMO.

I have helped players out progress and I have to admit, I power them though the levels so that they have a chance at getting to where I am, however, now they don't last because they don't know how to use MQ2 and get intimidated when one player can blow though DSK3/VT with three groups. I recently got some of my lower toons on and helped Fremgang, however, it appears that they are mostly gone now.

It’s a tough problem but I don't think that getting rid of MQ2 at this point would solve it. It would just make the few that are here now go.
D. B. A. Galdace

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xadien
Posts: 390

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#14 » Fri May 20, 2016 2:45 am

Good point. the HOH grind was intense. We did lose quite a few on that stuff that is for sure.
Voki
<Sanctuary>
Guild Leader

mrhorrn
Posts: 295

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#15 » Mon May 23, 2016 12:42 pm

MQ2 is the reason i enjoy playing this server so much. It's just so easy to log in and play for 30 mins, an hour, a couple of hours, however long i want or have spare, doing whatever i might fancy doing.

I don't have time to log in, sit LFG or potter around looking for stuff to do while i wait for other people to get on to do things. With Mq2 i can login, do what i want, for as long as i want, and log off when i want with no risk or hassle to my RL or to other players. There's no "Oh the raid is just starting.. so expect to be up too late while we try and get as far as we can", or logging in and sitting LFG for a couple of hours just to have no time to actually exp when i get a group and immediately have to ditch them.
This is also where timezones would have to come into it. How many groups would an EU guy get when the majority are US players (I don't know if this is true, but it's an example)? How much could they raid and progress without raiding into the early hours?

There were guilds dedicated to non-boxers for people who couldnt or didnt want to box so they could do their content properly, though i imagine people would join, find noone on and eventually stop playing as they couldnt do anything.

For me personally this poll is, Do i want to:
1) Log in and do things as, when and for as long as i want
2) Log in, check Guild to see noone on, LFG in ooc to (maybe sometimes, perhaps often?) get no response, run a few laps of the forest vaulting tree stumps and log off bored. It'll only happen so many times before i don't try again.
3) If this means you can send commands but can't use scripts, then that doesn't affect me as i don't have any anyway.
If scripts were blocked would larger teams have to cut down their groups and maybe have to coop with others playing manually? I don't know the impact on this for you guys who do.

Since most people tend to play their tanks the most, gearing, auging and donoring them before others for easier survival / better times, no boxing would mean there would be loads of tanks LFG and not too many groups to seat them, otherwise all that time and money would go to waste... unless there was a conversion / transfer service in place to move donors to other toons maybe?

If i had the time i would prefer a more social EQ but as i don't, these are my personal 2 pennies on the most efficient use of my time here.


Cheers,
Kyrann
--- Kyrann Horrn ---

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Belvino
Posts: 218

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#16 » Wed May 25, 2016 2:26 pm

I've only played on this server while MQ2 has been an option. I played on Live for 10+ years and even 6 boxed there with no MQ. When I joined THF i had never heard of MQ2. Once I was informed about it MQ2 it brought a whole knew level of Eq Crack. The active population been picking up lately but for a while there 2-10 people were normal. When the conditions are like that it a lot of fun to get the full crew out and rape, pillage, and loot. When people are on its easy to dial back and only play a couple people. Keeping MQ2 as an option IMO helps give you more options. I'd rather play with 12 or 24 guildies anyday. But i think the most I've had on when i wasn't in a guild by myself was 8ish i think.

This isn't overly MQ related but i feel some people think MQ apart in the game and just want to do their own thing. An idea would be changing how some of the older content if accessed. Keeping the old content guild only hurts newer folks. If it wasn't to much trouble having some of the content vt style would be cool. Even if you just opened it up and made it competitive content would be interesting. I not sure enough people still do the content for it to be a problem. And some folks would invite new or anybody at all to join them in sharing kills. Just food for thought.

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Longfeathers
Posts: 87

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#17 » Thu May 26, 2016 6:06 pm

I've been on leave enroute a pcs and I've gotten the mmo bug again, and I spotted this awesome thread. Rude's post sounds amazing.

~Regards,
Longfeathers
<Chiron>

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Denizen
Posts: 882

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#18 » Sat May 28, 2016 5:40 am

Well back from a long road trip...

Those of us who box are probably in a bit deep to want to change horses now and drop MQ2. I resisted MQ2 at first, as I boxed 5 accounts on live for many years with no 3rd party software...but eventually the convenience and power of MQ2 could simply not be denied.

If folks REALLY want a no MQ server then I would guess that nobody could readily box over one group without MQ2. So IF MQ2 were prohibited I would suggest that those who have donor items on more than 6 characters could convert the donor items on the characters greater than 6 to credit so they could then convert that credit to donor items for the characters in the one group they maintain. Not too huge of a one-time hassle.

I made a suggestion similar to Rude's quite a while ago "two servers idea" that didn't generate a whole lot of interest but now, maybe the time has come. I suggested at the time that a modest monthly fee could be charged on a one character per player server or, as that is hard to implement, a no third party software server. I still think this is a great idea as the content of THF is so unique and quite an achievement.

I would whole-heartedly support a no MQ THF server and an MQ THF Server.... not really a great intuitive leap over say, a PVP server and a non-PVP server like in Project 99. The question is, of course, would the admin be up for the additional server...

Yes there ARE different numbers of players on 99 on the PVP server and the non-PVP server...but so what? I would guess there would be some movement between two THF servers and it would add to the diversity of the types of folks who are attracted to THF>
Rafe, 70 sk

jsre
Posts: 188

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#19 » Sat Jun 04, 2016 1:25 pm

Lillu wrote:
jsre wrote:Purely for polling purposes I voted to prohibit, but it would be unfortunate if it went that way now. The server's identity has been well established in the emu community.


Don't be small minded jsre, you are better than that. ;) Good to see you BTW!


Lillu If you think I am being small minded and responding poorly, you've simply misinterpreted my comment. I'm saying that while I personally prefer servers which don't cater to MQ, the server has an established identity which does cater to MQ. You've built a playerbase on the back of that and changing that identity now would impact those players. I assumed those players would see it as a negative and the results of the poll correlate strongly with my assumption.

Hence if you are considering an MQ free server, my opinion is that you should release it as a new server and retune encounters to suit the size of the playerbase.

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Shanefpt
Posts: 119
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Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#20 » Sun Nov 13, 2016 6:16 pm

In my honest opinion, removing, or limiting (depending on what the limitations are -- I noticed that it was suggested that the "base plugins/scripts" be used; not precisely sure what those are since I use MQEmu not the official MQ2 or the more popular Redguides version) Macroquest use will pretty much turn the THF experience into that of what Live had become when my family and I left Live, something geared toward non-casual players.

The thought causes me to reminisce of times where I was loitering about WoS for hours with an LFG tag overhead, waiting for that tankless group to come along -- when finally, hurrah! Here they come... At first all seemed well -- then I began getting random "Fuzzynutz is inspecting you" messages and then the questions came... "How much HP and AC do you have? How many AA's?" followed by comments, "ROFLZ! I have wizards with more HP/AC than that! We don't accept people with less than 10,000 AA's in this group. You're not uber enough. Sorry..." Then you wait around about another hour or so for a group being jeered at by the 12 year old ebayers who have more money than game experience, before realizing you could be better spending your time rearranging your clothes drawers...

I realize that this is a bit of an extreme setting but it happened to the old Kurze and Flint quite often, probably more hours than I was able to actually play. Usually I'd find myself heading back to Noble's Causeway or Bloodfields (or porting to Plane of Innovation/Fear/Disease) to solo a bit before being bored to tears and logging out.

My family's main attraction to THF is the ability to progress solo. We all have careers and our own home lives and cannot afford to be on EQ 24/7 to keep up with all the cool kids. In our downtime we enjoy the escape of EQ but are not capable of keeping up with all the newest trending raids, items, and zones due to our real life responsibilities.

At THF, with the ability to box, we can make smaller progress and accomplishments solo and then take down larger challenges when we are able to get two or three groups of our boxed toons online together. With my brother's new job, wife's new job, my new position, and my son's waning interest in EQ (he is a shiny graphics/explosions millennial gamer) -- we have less grouping time than ever before. Considering that we are all moving into T7 after several years of progress on THF -- the thought of this is actually scary to us. We worry, will we be forced to quit EQ again after finally getting to the near endgame spot in our character growth once more.

Those who have the most elite, endgame characters will benefit from this kind of thing because they will control the direction of what many others will choose to do -- because it will be by necessity to follow them for all others. However, to those growing in the game, they will be forced to follow others on what will feel like a rail-based play style unable to explore most content alone. I personally feel that this idea will destroy a large part of the fun factor for the casual gaming crowd by limiting them to doing what certain others are doing.

I never liked the idea of MQ and always regarded it as cheating. I always preferred the idea of grouping with others (and still do), but also hate waiting for days where that is more or less a possibility. Especially with my extremely limited play times. I like being able to make progress in raid zones while solo playing through boxing. The ability to make gains without others, especially figuring out new tricks and tactics against raid mobs (where you would otherwise be unable to experiment in such ways) is awesome. At THF with MQ you can better understand EQ than ever before, instead of just being forced to follow the most uber player and simply do precisely what they tell you to do while not really knowing why.

I box my group/groups through the use of custom hotbuttons (just learned how to use multiline social buttons) and Melee to handle my DPS section, cycling through their basic attack/skill functions. I have played (and still do play) all of the characters solo (usually for AAing) and develop better opinions of use and group implementation, which typically allows me one step further in progressing my toons. Whenever I make that advancement I share with the family and we step forward. If we lost MQ usage we would likely lose the ability to progress. We would likely be forced to shutdown our guild and meld into another. Since we are all pacifist social types we would likely not get much more done because we would not know how to ask anyone to go through the trouble of helping us, and would likely be intimidated by the other characters in the guild we wind up in. Also, and this happened on Live as well, we'd probably end up in different guilds and our family would socialize less with one another. My brother and son are more aggressive players and my mother and wife are extremely passive -- while I remain more-or-less moderate. I'm what glues us together. However, if we were unable to progress together, we would drift apart in the game -- and also in life... again.

It is difficult living several thousand miles apart...

If you do choose to do such a thing, maybe having a separate server for single account play would be good for those that crave such, but if it were implemented to the current server and population, I think many would simply leave. In our case, my brother would disband a few alts to an uber raiding guild, my son would quit and go back to ESO, my wife would turn to Facebook games and disappear into DragonAge again for months at a time, I would likely eventually leave because I would get bored in my permanent "LFG" status, and my mom, who is permanently disabled now, would solo around when she could but likely drift away through time.

Just my honest point of view -- take it or leave it...
Kurzesblatt Göttlichestahl ~ First Officer of "Ministry of Pain"
"Come... feel our pain!" http://www.ministryofpain.guildportal.com

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