Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Tell us what you think!

Poll: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

No, leave it the way it is now.
85
60%
Yes, completely prohibit MQ2 usage.
14
10%
Limit the MQ2 usage to basic plugins and commands (/stick, etc) and possibly offer a THF MQ2 release.
42
30%
Total votes: 141

Ydiss
Posts: 1193

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#21 » Thu Feb 01, 2018 8:34 pm

I know this is an old poll but wanted to add my thoughts.

We started on this server about 2007 I think, just the two of us. At that time we had one character each and used a bot (oh the memories of using a bot :)). Once we got to 70+, we quickly realised our progression would begin to slow and eventually stop entirely without more numbers.

We had no intention of joining another, existing guild because we really didn't want to play on someone else's schedule. We did make a couple friends who we invited to our guild but, still, we would have needed more and we wanted to be able to do things ourselves. I'd done the whole raid guild thing on live and, to be honest, hated it. I had no intention of doing that again. Definitely not running one.

I began by trying to manually box with some success. We were able to do ToV but it was really tough managing the extra boxes. It was just me, to begin with. It was fun in itself and challenging but when something went slightly wrong then it all usually went very wrong.

Then I tried MQ2. Initially, it was just the basics. But as I learned more about it then I began adding more functionality to what I could do. My friend Rigz took the plunge and we were soon pushing the limits on how many characters we could control (and run concurrently).

Before long, we'd leveled up a raid force and written lots of scripts and we'd started to progress at a fun rate (still slow, the content on this server is very well designed).

We reached T7 and the encounters became more and more challenging, requiring a mixture of improving our gear, our tactics and our scripts.

The pinnacle of this was beating the Lithlurian encounter, quite clearly designed to counter MQ2 (whether by intent or not). This was probably the first encounter that we beat primarily because of intensive scripting. It felt like a huge achievement but mostly due to our ability to build scripts to control 24+ characters precisely in order to defeat the boss.

There have been so many highlights (our Zek kill was just one of them, an encounter that didn't require much scripting at all but was probably one of the biggest, long term challenges we faced).

We were starting out on the second raft of bosses in T8 when we stopped playing. We're back now but are only playing a single group (3 each) through from scratch (no PLing).

The thing is, we would have stopped playing way back when we were just two 70+ characters if I hadn't started boxing and not much longer after then had we not used MQ2. And we would have missed out so much enjoyment. Because the game, with MQ2, was enormously fun.

It still is now, in our single group.

In an ideal world, the server would have hundreds of players looking to group together. At one point, it did have hundreds of concurrent players. Whilst we couldn't commit to another guild (or just didn't want to) at any point, we always helped out others, let others join us (where not guild instanced), had others help us and so on.

My personal favourite memory was working with Fulken to complete the warrior 3.0. We got the weapon at the same time, he was the first to get it on the server (and I was second, 5 seconds later :)). We achieved this because we worked together and that happens here all the time, regardless of Mq2.

Mq2 didn't make us reclusive. It just let us have tons of fun. And I think it was used just as much back when the server was at its highest population as it is used now. I think this server is the best run and has the best content without equal and I'm really glad you guys allowed mq2.

Ydiss
Posts: 1193

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#22 » Fri Feb 02, 2018 11:29 am

Can't edit the post now but I wanted to add to my comment about completing the warrior 3.0... I'd forgotten to mention that Mystickitty helped us with the tradeskill combines and Nilbus helped with EQ lore to solve some of the puzzles. It really felt like a community win :)

Taladome
Posts: 275

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#23 » Sat Feb 03, 2018 10:13 am

I always connected mq with cheating. But when it comes down to it you do what you have to in the sake of progression or the game is simply over. I remember boxing a war cleric wiz without mq, I remember it being hard for everyone to be on at the same time to keep everyone up to date. I remember not having enough members on to kill vulak so we made ranger bots, grouped them up, and figured out how to position them just right to get the job done. I remember not being able to take down avatars and the few of us online made additional clerics boxed them spamming heals and DI to get the job done. Is what I have mentioned here any different from using MQ2? I don't think so. It makes it easier to box, but does not make the content any easier.

I recently came back to a guild with no members that have logged on since 2012. So, try to join another guild and fit thier schedule, or box my own group and go at my own pace. I downloaded mq2 and box a single group which I am still trying to figure out the right combination of members to balance everything out but there is content I as a single group will not be able to complete and I am ok with that because there is alot of content I can complete. Even scripting can get you only so far and alot of the time luck plays just as big of a role with all the bugs you have to deal with.

So what do you do? Create a single serverwide guild for everyone and force them to join? Drama. Tell everyone unable to keep up with others schedules remain in lower content or solo? Drama. Doesnt matter what you choose you just can't avoid the drama and drama has killed more guilds and servers than anything else. If they banned mq2 tomorrow id try boxing my single group to its limits until I could not progress and got bored then leave. If they banned boxing all together I would leave even sooner because I just don't need the drama.

I do not think anyone has been rejected from joining a guild because they do not box 20 characters? Do I hate others who box 20 chars with mq2 and can do everything ? No, thats a choice, I choose to box a single group no more no less thats my choice. With my schedule its impossible for me to even consider raiding with others without leaving before the raid was near to being over.

I have to agree with others that mq2 is not causing a population problem here if anything its helping keep those who are still here playing. With all the changes that have been made I think the focus should be on attracting new players and keeping them here. Rewards for returning players or referalls. You want to limit the token drops but you don't reward anyone for going back and doing content just to flag people. How about items that can only be obtained by flagging new recruits. Auras or items powered by the unique ip numbers a guild has logged in. Don't force them to do something but rather make it worth while to do so.


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Denizen
Posts: 882

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#24 » Sat Feb 03, 2018 4:32 pm

Well I see MQ2 use and the resultant rise and dominance of single player hordes (myself included) as the direct result of not enough folks on, just like Taladome. So just like with Tokens, I suggest that there is a MOTIVATION for more folks to play and raid together.

How about this, the more IPs that are present in a raid (loosely equivalent to more players) the more likely it is that rare loot tables will open. For example, Luclin in VT has the following rare loot table:

Loot Table
Chance for table to be used: 5%.
# Items Selected From Table: 1

Item Type Item Chance
Helmet of Darkness Armor 25%
Cloak of Darkness Armor 25%
Scaled Shoulderpads of Darkness Armor 25%
Mark of Luclin Armor 25%


So I suggest say, 1% chance be added for each IP represented. So if 10 IPs are present then the likelihood of this loot table being used is 15%

The problem is MOTIVATION. It is easier, once you've assembled your horde, to just go and do it. It will take much much longer to assemble a raid of different parties, all on at the same time, to do the raid. And the loots are split, so it becomes less likely that you will get anything out of the raid. So why deal with getting folks together, herding cats (sorry Mystickitty) and etc. when you can just do it yourself?

Actually I may be a bit conservative on the loot table percentages....if you actually got a raid going with 10 separate entities, IPs, first of all you deserve sainthood for patience. Maybe the rare table should be upped by 5% for each IP, IDK. But clearly there is close to no motivation for raiding with others, if you raid for items, and making loot tables sensitive to the number of separate IPs involved, would be one way of providing an incentive for folks to group up and raid together.

To summarize: The idea is to provide direct in game motivation to raid together by making drops per actual player similar or even better if you cooperate and raid together rather than for everyone to just have their own horde.

This is similar to tokens...there is currently nothing to do with tokens other than to give them out or sell them. I'd like to see some way in which they can be turned in for something....maybe a chance for rare loots, LDON points, AA advancement tokens.... something. If this can be done, then you pull more tokens out of the game and you give the person with a token a choice: give or sell it to someone or turn it in for a chance at an item. This keeps token inflation from occurring (I can see VT tokens selling for 5k) and it provides additional motives to do raids to collect tokens.
Rafe, 70 sk

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Dred
Posts: 229

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#25 » Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:41 am

I agree with Rafe on pretty much everything he said. As another member of the single player dominate horde I don't have any motivation to raid with others other than just wanting some company from time to time or trying to help someone gear up. I only play a few days a month at best so it is impossible for me to make some plans to be on and raid and such and such time.

When I do get on I am focused on what I want to take down as quickly and efficiently as I can to make the most of my time. I frankly don't want to get on and gather up 4 or 5 people to raid and then 1 person goes afk for 30 to 45 minutes and then when they get back another one does it and I am just kinda stuck there doing nothing when I could have been doing my own thing during that time. Things come up when folks are playing. We all know it and mostly understand it. Even though I only use basic eqbc commands and all of 1 simple macro without MQ2 I would have left ages ago.

While a little off topic perhaps but I love his idea with the token turn in for some items, potions, something. Hell even just turning in so many for a unique illusion item that is just a clicky with no stats would be good for me. 1 token for this illusion, 5 for this one, 10 and so on. Say maybe 10 VT tokens for a choice of illusion from past Halloween events. Or maybe an aug of some type. The number of tokens and better the token the better the aug or illsuion. Just something.
Cadaveria the Queen of Shadows - Retired

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mystickitty
Posts: 921

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#26 » Sun Feb 04, 2018 12:14 pm

Ydiss wrote:Can't edit the post now but I wanted to add to my comment about completing the warrior 3.0... I'd forgotten to mention that Mystickitty helped us with the tradeskill combines and Nilbus helped with EQ lore to solve some of the puzzles. It really felt like a community win :)


Glad I could help :D .

I honestly don't have much to say about MQ. I only use it for /stick. Other than that, i'm too lazy and too n00b to figure it out too far. I do everything manually ( Which sucks and I don't recommend :P ) . I can see where these guys are coming from. It's a lonely world out here these days lol. Only a slight reason behind me never being around. I can't kill much alone and having no one to hang out with is a major bummer. Thanks for letting my slow n00b butt tag along with you for VT last time Cad! :D

But to add to the thoughts of different ways to obtain some cool treats, that would be cool.
Mystickitty
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Dred
Posts: 229

Re: Would you like to see MQ2 usage prohibited or limited on THF?

Post#27 » Sun Feb 04, 2018 2:03 pm

You aren't slow or a noob Kitty lol. It was my pleasure. Like I said it is nice to have some company sometimes and feel free if you see me on to join up :D
Cadaveria the Queen of Shadows - Retired

Leader of Legion of Darkness

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